S&W M&P AR in .300 Whisper (factory rifle)

[rsilvers]

Originally Posted by Alleycat

I have 500 new primed Hornady brass and some sample 300 Blackout brass and they spec out exactly the same. They even weigh the same. (83.3 grains give or take a couple of tenths)

That is because the Hornady brass is 300 BLK spec brass.

Originally Posted by Alleycat

If Remington made their brass to Blackout spec, it wouldn’t even chamber in a Whisper because of the huge difference in chamber dimensions.

Who said there is a difference in chamber dimensions when it comes to brass? While I have never seen an SSK drawing, I am under the impression, based on talking to a licensee, that the only significant difference is in the throat.

Originally Posted by Alleycat

My hand loads will not chamber in the blackout because of the Whisper’s longer throat.

You have this backwards. The BLK has the longer throat.

Originally Posted by Alleycat

I would think ammo manufactures would load for the smallest chamber or change it enough so that it will not load in the similar chamber for legal reasons.

Certainly if you commercially load for Whisper(R), you need to load for the smallest chamber ever called Whisper.

Originally Posted by Alleycat

Getting Robert to admit that would be as hard as getting Kwik2sue to admit his agenda. Robert I do understand your reluctance and I have taken up for you much to the chagrin of people I consider good friends, but sometimes it’s better to say nothing at all.

I am not sure I follow you. What am I reluctant to say?

[Alleycat]

Originally Posted by rsilvers

That is because the Hornady brass is 300 BLK spec brass.

It's stamped 300 Whisper.

Who said there is a difference in chamber dimensions when it comes to brass? While I have never seen an SSK drawing, I am under the impression, based on talking to a licensee, that the only significant difference is in the throat.

Agreed.

You have this backwards. The BLK has the longer throat.

No I don't. In my SSK Whisper straight from JDJ has a longer throat than the Blackout I own. The 300-221 fireball has a very short throat. Which chambering did you play with? I would be happy to ship my SSK upper to you or AAC for verification.

Certainly if you commercially load for Whisper(R), you need to load for the smallest chamber ever called Whisper.

So the Remington Blackout ammo I just ordered won't chamber in my Whisper?

I am not sure I follow you. What am I reluctant to say?

Just that I understand that there are things you can't say because of legal reasons. I don't blame you for picking your words carefully. If you ever did say Blackout ammo could be shot out of a Whisper someone would try to use it aganst AAC and Remington. I've been on your side, but the comment that Smith & Wesson's people are "wrong" rubs me the wrong way. You may be right, but you could also use some tact. Like I said sometimes it's better to say nothing at all.

[rsilvers]

Originally Posted by Alleycat

It's stamped 300 Whisper.

I know, but it is verified to be within 300 AAC BLACKOUT specs, and tested in 300 AAC BLACKOUT guns.

[rsilvers]

Originally Posted by Alleycat

No I don't. In my SSK Whisper straight from JDJ has a longer throat than the Blackout I own. The 300-221 fireball has a very short throat. Which chambering did you play with? I would be happy to ship my SSK upper to you or AAC for verification.

Ok, I will remember that I don't really know about SSK chambers. I do know there are at least two, maybe four or more different chambers called 300 Whisper. If you want to be sure you can shoot 300 AAC BLACKOUT ammo, it is best to run a 300 BLK reamer in it.

[rsilvers]

Originally Posted by Alleycat

So the Remington Blackout ammo I just ordered won't chamber in my Whisper?

I don't know. We took Remington 221 Fireball and opened it to 30 cal, but kept the same headspace, and picked some radii for the neck and shoulder - and a chamber neck diameter which would work with most 223 and 5.56mm converted brass, and then set the throat so that if you loaded a Sierra 220 to 2.26 OAL, it would be 0.010 from the lands.

[rsilvers]

Originally Posted by Alleycat

Just that I understand that there are things you can't say because of legal reasons. I don't blame you for picking your words carefully. If you ever did say Blackout ammo could be shot out of a Whisper someone would try to use it aganst AAC and Remington.

I would not claim you could shoot 300 BLK ammo in a Whisper for many reasons other than legal - I have never tried it.

Originally Posted by Alleycat

I've been on your side, but the comment that Smith & Wesson's people are "wrong" rubs me the wrong way. You may be right, but you could also use some tact. Like I said sometimes it's better to say nothing at all.

I see - you are excited that there is a factory rifle chambered in Whisper. Yes, I can understand that.

[sha-ul]

Originally Posted by Alleycat

300 Whisper OAL<======
300 Blackout OAL <=====
300-221 FB OAL <====


I wonder if they will come out with 264 LB or the 6.5 Grendel next.

complete derail here, but I remember reading last week that the owners of the 6.5 have surrendered their trademark on the Grendel so that it could be standardized via SAAMI

[rsilvers]

[sha-ul]

that is actually a pretty good pic Ron, it has almost an art feel to it.

[Mike Bell]

•Chambered in .300 Whisper®
Will also safely fire .300 AAC Blackout.

from the S&W web site