LouBoyd 450 marlin post?

[Spook]

Where is the info Lou had posted on the 450 marlin?...I cant find it I thought I remembered pics..? Perhaps I've contracted sometimers.

[LouBoyd]

Originally Posted by Spook

Where is the info Lou had posted on the 450 marlin?...I cant find it I thought I remembered pics..? Perhaps I've contracted sometimers.

In the thread "458 Socom" on this forum I discussed the merits of the 458X2 vs the 458 Socom. Hunter2 asked if the 450 Marlin is similar. I posted a picture of both the 458 Socom and 458x2 loaded with the 583grain Lehighs (and others) for comparison. Is that what you're thinking of? I've never used a 450 Marlin. I compared it when I selected the 458x2 which I chose mostly because I found reamers and dies on ebay.
They are very similar.
I chose 458x2 over 458 Socom mostly becasue I thought it might feed better in a 700 Long action and my "doner rifle already had a magnum bolt face. Also because the 458x2 has a higher pressure rating. We can continue the discussion here if you'd like.

[Spook]

Lou, Thanks.
I'm also looking at a long 700 build and with regard to feeding I was wondering about the 450 Marlin as an alternative to the socom. How much difference in case capacity is there? ....building it with the Lehigh as the "go to" bullet and would get the reamer ground for it.
I really prefer light charges of fast powder in bolt guns in which case less would be better.

[LouBoyd]

case_______pressure__cap___len____ type
458 Socom__35000___61.6__1.573____ rebated head (308) bottleneck.
458x2______59988___73.0___2.000____ straightwall_belted magnum (WinMag)
458 Marlin__47862____74.0__2.080____ straightwall belted magnum (WinMag)
(numbers from Quickload database)

http://stevespages.com/jpg/cd458x2.jpg
http://stevespages.com/jpg/cd450marlin.jpg

I believe the the pressure ratings on all of them have more to do with the guns they're expected to be shot in than the strength of the brass.

While I agree about the using fast powders and high pressure being good in subsonics its the usable chamber volume with the bullet inserted which is important, not the total case capacity. Straight wall cases allow deep seating as the "neck" is very long. The 458 Socom case does allow a shorter overall length for a given usable case capacity because it's inside diameter is larger. I'd suggest making up dummy rounds can checking actual chamber capacity before making a choice.

[Spook]

Good info Lou. I wouldnt have thought to check the capacity with a seated bullet. Thanks!

[LouBoyd]

Originally Posted by Spook

Good info Lou. I wouldnt have thought to check the capacity with a seated bullet. Thanks!

Hi Spook
(and anyone else who works with non-standard cartridges, bullets, and loads)
Do you use Quickload? If not I think you'd find it useful. Quickload allows investigating powders, projectiles and performance much more rapidly then shooting tests, Live shooting tests are still necessary to trim loads for best accuracy, but you can rapidly focus on things which are likely to work well. Among other things it calculates actual case capacity vs seating depth including the volume occupied by boattail bullets. For a given cartridge, bullet, and seating depth it can test hundreds of powder choices in a couple of seconds giving case fills and pressures vs several chosen parameters such as a specific velocity or highest velocities for a specific pressure.

Quickload allows "test firing" in software showing many parameters which are hard to measure such as pressure vs time and bullet travel down the barrel. It's especially good for working on subsonic loads where things like lubrication, engraving forces and bore friction are more significant that with supersonic cartridges.

Quickload is $150 and runs on various versions of MS Windows. A disk with new bullets, powders, and projectiles is offered every couple of years, typically for $15. It's written and maintained by Hartmut Brooemel who is a German ballistics researcher and benchrest shooter.
http://www.neconos.com/shop/?cart=256425&cat=2