Model 1 Sales 300 whisper upper function problems

[Artful]

Hello new guy from Arizona trying to get information and make my mind up about how I want my upper for subsonic loads.

Some background I'm newish to AR's and have already decided on CAV15 lower (CAR spring & buffer in MarkII). I'm looking at the all information on this site (well still looking thru it) and think I have my wish list.

Flat top upper - Free Floating forearm - Pistol position AGT - Stainless 16 inch barrel 8 inch twist treaded for the ACC Cyclone I have coming. But based on what I see on this thread I wouldn't order Model 1 upper for anything.

I see how much trouble you guys seem to be having with Model 1 upper's with carbine position non-AGT and wonder if someone hasn't expressed to them that they need to offer the option of having the pistol position with adjustable gas system....? After all you guys talked to them didn't they say anything other than our well broken in test rifle ran perfectly with every load under creation.

I mean they need to wake up - you should have to tinker like that with a production product (drilling out ports ) stuff like that is part of where the AR jamomatic stories started.

But just wondered as the new guy on the forum - it's nice to have found you all. :D

[d-mon]

I have read a lot of threads recently about people who had cycling problems with their AR uppers.
But would the problem had existed if the work had been done by serious guys who know about it like SSK industries?

Sorry, I just try to understand things here.
ND

[jripper]

I have no doubt that SSK make a better product, and that it would work right off the bat. However, if I remeber correctly, a .300 whisper SSK upper is around $1000 (upper only). I think I paid around $500 for a complete upper and lower parts kit.

For the extra $500 I save on a M1S, I don't mind tinkering a little to make it run.

If you have the extra cash, by all means, go with the SSK.

If not, and you aren't afraid to work on it a little, go with the M1S.

Just my thoughts,
Joel

[d-mon]

I did not know how much they charged. i understand now.

D-mon

[GMHA375]

To each his own.

Mine: SSK upper, SSK suppressor, corbon 220 subsonic ammo. Perfect flawless function from the first round. Worth every penny to not have to fiddle with it.

[AR15barrels]

Originally Posted by jripper

For the extra $500 I save on a M1S, I don't mind tinkering a little to make it run.
Joel

I understand the logic when there is a $500 difference, but also realize that you are buying a $70 shaw barrel at the $500 price point.

$1000 is on the high side for a complete upper considering JD probably uses a $200 Shilen blank.

I can sell you a complete Shilen or Douglas barreled upper for about $750.
It will be custom made to your specs.
The throat will be perfectly centered in the bore, the gas port will be the right size and location (pistol) for both supersonic and subsonic loads.
I also take JP adjustable gas blocks and turn them down so that you can easily fit them under a freefloat tube.

You will not find any 7 page forum topics about getting my barrels to run right...

Randall Rausch
www.ar15barrels.com

[MMA10mm]

I too bought a Model 1 Sales 300/221 kit w/ assembled upper, and have had the same experiences.

I've read about the opened-up port in the standard shorty location, but that seems like a marginal fix to me. It will probably work with subsonic, and to get best success, use a chrome-plated AR-style (lighter-weight) bolt carrier, a lighter weight buffer spring, and don't plan on shortening the barrel any...

I want my lower to work with other uppers, without changing out the buffer spring, so that's out. I want to be able to utilize a heavier bolt carrier and shorter barrel, so now we're back to marginal operations...

In my opinion, if you're going through all the trouble to modify it, make it as close to the SSK upper as possible: TIG weld the gas port under the front sight, drill a new port at the pistol position (7-8" depending on whose gas tube you use), and for best operation, get an adjustable gas block.

This is more involved than just drilling out the port, but it will be the most flexible in terms of working with the widest selection of loads, and with the least amount of fiddling with the lower and bolt. Theoretically, these modifications should keep the 300 upper modular, as the whole AR system is meant to be, meaning you can swap out bolt/bolt carriers, and put the upper on different lowers with a high probability of it working...

Lastly, there have been some posts here in this thread which show the downfall of the JP gas block. (the allen wrench) To be fair, the JP block was designed for use on target guns at the match ranges, where mis-laying an allen wrench or leaving it at home will not get you killed. But, if you have a 300 for field use, I would think you'd want an adjustment device that is always attached. Again, I look back to the SSK upper, and note that they install a large knob with a coin slot that shows up through one of the holes in the upper handguard. I will be working on something that will work similarly with the JP gas block on mine...

My next problem to overcome is how to work the adjustment device around a solid 4-rail handguard without cutting holes through the Picatinny rails... When I get it all sorted out, I'll post some pictures here.

[Cornholio]

Sounds interesting! I need a fix for my gas block/tube set-up, so I'm eager to see how yours comes out!

[jripper]

I agree that moving the gas port to the pistol position would be the best way to go. I do not have a problem with my AA 1680 load with subsonics, with either a full butt stock, or car, using stock springs and bolt carrier. However, as previously noted, it will not work with faster powders. This is adequate for my uses. However, if you want it to function with any subsonic loads, you had probably better move the port.

Joel

[MMA10mm]

Well, before modification, Cor-Bon 220gr Subsonics won't work, but my handloads with 150gr FMJs and 17.5grs of W-680 (Surplus from Jeff Bartlett) worked just fine... Cycled every time!

Also was able to make hot loads with H-110 work, but they were about 1.0gr overload. (They were right at the suggested max load from SSK, and I was using more voluminous Rem. 221 brass vs. the re-formed mil. brass that SSK uses, but they were still hot...)

Anyway, at least I could get the thing to shoot semi-automatically before modification... I'll probably shoot it some more and then do the mods when the weather gets bad.