300 Whisper vs 300/221 fireball

[Cold]

Ok, I am looking to buy a 300 Whisper within the next week.

I have been reading about it on and off, I read alot for my job and sometimes I get sick of reading, and would like someone to tell me, whats the difference between the two? I notice that people make a point to call one x and the other y for a reason.

On Model 1's site it says 300/221 Fb, but I was told they sold 300 W barrels, so any help guys?

Im not new to AR Variants but this one I need to learn more on, so Im going to buy one ! Thanks in advance.

[pug]

Cold basically JD Jones trademarked the Whisper name so only he can sell true 300 Whisper spec barrels along with T/C who licensed it from him (maybe more now). All the others have to name theirs slightly different and alter the specs just a little. Oly's is 300 Fireball and definitley has a loose enough chamber to be a F/A gun and feed and extract very smoothly. By my measurements true JDJ whisper is the next tightest chamber and appears to be fine in AR-15 also. Some brass formed from 223 is said to be tight in the whisper. The 300/221 chamber is a little tighter still and has a little less freebore but definitely makes for an accurate cartridge. This is the chamber I use in my AR's because I am use to shooting bench guns and like for the little auto to shoot just as good if possible. I have found several lots of mil brass that I felt were too tight to use in the 300/221. Not all though as I just picked up several thousand LC brass and spot checking the necks all seem to be thin enough to use. If you are going to shoot long heavy bullets supersonic you may have to get the 300/221 chamber throated a little deeper to keep pressure down. Other than trying to neck up some 221 Fireball cases briefly, I pretty much use only 223 brass now. If you think you will be shooting subsonics then definitely get the 1:8 twist but if supersonic is your only game then the 1:10 will stabilize them. Hope I made sense and good luck.

The m1s barrels are ported in the carbine position and many feel they do not cycle lighter weight subsonics as well as barrels ported in the pistol position. Supersonic cycles fine.

[Cold]

Pug, thanks for the reply, that did help.

Heres my break down. Right now Id like to build a 300 Whipser which will shoot supersonic loads as I am in a state which is a "ban state" if you will, however having once resided in Texas, I will return there soon, so I would like the option to add a can, and then shoot the sub sonics.

Basically, I want a barrel which will do it all. My guess is, I will need to go with the SSK/JDJ barrel, however I was going to call C4iGrant and order one of his 16 inch Noveske barrels if you feel this would also handle everything, thoughts?

[Night Shooter]

Gentlemen,
I just purchased a Model "1" upper in .30-221 Whisper in 1 in 8 " twist 16" barrel. It is being threaded today to fit my supressor. In conversation with Paul at Model "1" sales he told me that if you are having any cycle problems shooting subsonic to change the recoil spring and buffer from a rifle stock to a carbine buffer and spring assyembly and that would take care of the problem.
I waiting to build brass/loads and gun. UPS...waiting ! Aditionally, I spoke with J.D. of SSK industries moments ago. He is refusing to sell any pre-made brass to anyone that doesn't purchase his barrel. FYI.

[redtazdog]

The wolff reduced buffer spring and reduced hammer spring if needed
help alotttt.
You can get the buffer spring for rifle or carbine.
http://www.gunsprings.com/1ndex.html

[320pf]

Cold,

If you want to build a 300-221 fireball (aka 300 whisper) that you can shoot both sub-sonic and super-sonic loads I would suggest that you go with a 16-inch barrel with the gas port in the pistol position. The gas port should be anywhere from 0.07 to 0.08 inches in diameter.

As far a making ammo. I am making all of my brass from either new Winchester 223 or various military brass. As of late, I do not worry too much about the neck thickness because I am loading 168 g Sierra MK with 8 to 9 grains of AA#9 or 2400 to get 1040 to 1080 fps. High pressures are not too big of a problem with this load.

When I was using just Winchester 223 brass I could push the 125 g TNT with 20 g of W296 and get about 2340 fps. When I tried this load with the military brass I would blow a primer every once in a while. I dropped this load down to 19.5 and have have shot about 1000 rounds of this load and I have not blow any primers. The stats for the 19.5 g load are (125 g Speer TNT with 19.5 g of W296 @ 2250 fps. This is the maximum load listed in the Sierra manual and as I mentioned above, I have not had any pressure signs with this load. I can live with 2250 instead of 2340

Let me know if you have any questions.

P.S. Pug and Kurtz are both very knowledgeable about the 300-221... so they are good sources of info as well.


320pf

[pug]

Cold,

I am sure the JDJ barrel will be top notch and I have heard good things about Noveske barrels also. If you are going to have a barrel made I would also go with a 16" 1:8 twist pistol ported barrel. It should give you the best all around performance.

[320pf]

Originally Posted by pug

Cold,

I am sure the JDJ barrel will be top notch and I have heard good things about Noveske barrels also. If you are going to have a barrel made I would also go with a 16" 1:8 twist pistol ported barrel. It should give you the best all around performance.

Pug,

Thanks, I forgot to mention the twist rate ... my bad

320pf

[kurtz]

hey guys,

I ran across something interesting a few weeks back.....I picked up a second hand Olympic 300 fireball flat-top upper....It is in the carbine "look" configuration with a 16" 1:8 barrel, A2 flash hider, A2 front sight post, carry handle, carbine handguards, and the Olympic gas block in the pistol location under the handguards....during inspection of the bore I noticed it had a second gas port under the front sight post....I pulled off the sight post and found that the top of the gas port had been brazed shut....I purchased the upper with the intent of building a super-sonic plinker....so I drilled out the front gas port with a .075 bit, removed the pistol location block and tapped and plugged the pistol port, installed a carbine length gas tube and went to town with 18gr of H110 and 125 TNT's....short stroked two or three times out of a 30rd mag, worked up to 18.5gr of H110 and cycles great....fit of system is pretty good and I do cut 2 full coils off all of my mag springs....Just thought it was funny to see a factory barrel with kinda sorta two ports

kurtz

[Pitt300]

Night Shooter,
I also am just working up loads for a M1S upper & Paul has been VERY helpful.
Was having trouble getting subs to cycle & just bought CAR buffer & spring from Paul.
Just got back from range & I put the CAR buffer in w/A2 spring & gun functioned fine w/sub load (which today went supersonic. I think due to fact that gun & ammo were in trunk today although it was only 60*-using H110). However gun did not lock open after last round but it did cycle all of them. I can live w/that!
I also shot some full power loads and didn't feel any recoil difference w/o A2 buffer in gun.