"another" deer dead, even though the .300 blk is not good for hunting
 

keep being told the .300 blkout is not good for deer.

4th one

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j2...Edoe002jpg.jpg

200gr Low velocity expander
935 fps

broke her spine had to finish her off with my .45

I was told the same thing. I promptly got the video camera out and made a bunch of videos just to prove them wrong. The lesson that is learned here is
1: Don’t tell me it can’t be done.
2: I am an expert on my own opinion.
3: You can humanly kill deer with subs.

That Deer, or a Greyhound ??? looks pretty small . LOL

Nobody is saying it cant be done .
Just saying . It's all relative to where you live & what size deer & game is in the area you hunt & terrain & distance you have to shoot deer .
,

Yea, mine didn't work very good either!

http://i922.photobucket.com/albums/a...1/15f7898d.jpg

White tail around hear do not get huge, but she was about 100lbs

Nice white tail doe here ... over 150 pounds. 16" suppressed 220 SMK at 1000 fps. Dropped at the shot. Hit her in the neck as intended.

Fortunately those who own 300 WTF rifles can learn the limitations and ignore the critics.
Does any state ban the 300 WTF but allow other centerfire rifles for deer hunting?

Actually the 300wtf may have a leg up in many other calibers, as some states restrict hunting to handgun calibers& the 300 has a pretty good history with silhouette shooters. plus it works well in bolt& semi auto guns, what's not to like?

I have found that some states require a cartridge to have a specific oal to use on deer. Dunno about about handgun hunting or what not since I usually hunt from my living room with a suppressed sbr anyhow 'gotta love when a security system is looking over the food plot in your back yard:cool:'

restrictions
 

In VA, a deer caliber must be centerfire greater than 22 caliber and deliver over 550 foot pounds of energy at 100 yards. A 300 whisper leaving a barrel subsonic at 1050 feet per second 220 grain bullet is over 900 foot pounds of energy at 100 yards, well over VA requirements. We can use suppressors for hunting also. I love VA! :smile:

Why do you guys call 300 BLK 300 WTF? The final SAAMI standard is established and has arrived. The final name is known. It is 300 AAC Blackout.

With my 300 Fireball being the same case length as the BLK, does that make it a BLK Match since it has a tighter chamber? :smile: 'Ya heard it here first folks: 300 Blackout Match!

Kevin

Ha, 300wtf match?

I believe it to be term of inclusion applicable to all cartridges that bear an uncanny resemblance to the 300 Whisper Mr.Silvers. :smile: You might make an attempt to get used to it rather than take it personally. It appears to have "stuck". Perhaps changing the headstamp should be considered?

Merry Christmas in any instance :smile: and best wishes for a Happy and profitable New Year.

Dont forget the (R):grin:

Just make sure to pay me royalties for that name:grin:

There seems to be two types of people who use the term. Previous Whisper(R) or 300-221 users like you, and people who are saying that 0.277 bullets are so much better than 30 caliber bullets.

By the way, your use of 'uncanny' raises the specter of originality. 300 BLK is a standardization of the 300-221 concept, which was sorely needed. Since this has happened, ammo has dropped from $45 a box to $12.50 a box. Brass has fallen from $1 each to 25 cents each (10 cents for reformed). Uppers went from $1200+ to under $500. 75 new companies are involved. It is good even for long-time users of 300-221 or Whisper(R).

5.56mm with 30 cal bullets goes back to at least 1969. And by the way, they all copied Remington's design of the case head dimensions and body taper - and I never saw anyone point out the irony of that.

Here is a photo of a 40+ year old cartridge:

http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/1981/eglint1t3b.jpg

Bob, first of all 5th sentence 2nd paragraph. Uppers have went? went? "Gone" would have made you sound as if you had completed middle school. Its difficult for me to take anything beyond that seriously.

Lastly, in this country when someone bestows Holiday greetings its customary to return the salutation.... something to consider as you make your New Years resolutions.... Kindest regard :smile:

I do because it covers all of the different flavors of the 300 Whisper. I guess that means I am lazy.

When I am talking about the Blackout, I call it as such.

When I am talking about the Blackout, I call it as such.[/QUOTE]

Me too! I just don't have one.

Mine was built before the Blackout, so I call it 300WTFever!

Get used to it!
 

It has picked up the moniker 300 WTF because this cartridge has gone by many different names (300 Whisper, 300-221 Fireball, 300 Fireball, 7.62x35mm, etc…). AAC just happen to add one more (300 AAC Blackout), enough to sort of "break the camels back". So those of us that have been shooting this cartridge for quite awhile have just given up trying to keep up with all of the different names so now it is just called the 300 WTF.

I personally think that the 300 AAC Blackout is a lousy name for several reasons.

First, it is too long of a name hence another reason that we call it the 300 WTF.

Second, AAC should have done a little bit of market research on the name. The name "300 AAC Blackout" sounds like a name a pimply face mall ninja kid would come up with or a slang name for a drug that a dorky college kid would put in a girls drink… think ruffy.

You probably should have gone with a simple name like "300-221 Fireball". Similar to how Remington went with the name 25-06.

Get used to it. It seems to have "stuck"

It is called 300 BLK for short.

If we did, then people would shoot it in chambers marked 300-221 or 300 Fireball, and that may raise pressures. A new name was needed.

This is my United States Of WTFever! :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xz7_3...yer_detailpage

long live the 300WTF
 

Oh great, yet another name for the same cartridge! I think that I will just stick with the "300 WTF"


Well most of us that were shooting the 300 WTF had managed to get it worked out before AAC came around the "set us straight". We all just went with the 221 Fireball necked up to 30 cal. This shot well in SSK barrels and in the barrels marked "300-221 or 300 Fireball".

I suspect that you are going to tell us about the "longer" throat of your chamber but by your own arguments that you have made about the 6.8 SPC vs the 6.8 SPCII chambers over on the 68 forums the longer throat only drops pressure by about 2000-4000 psi. I have shot factory 300WTF in all of my 300WTF uppers and the velocities are all within about ±30 fps of my hand loads. My load data are from the Sierra and Hornaday manuals so they are not crazy hot loads.

As far as the price of upper and ammo and ammo components going down, your argument is not very compelling. I bought my first complete 300 WTF upper for $450 in 2007 and have built and sold about 10 since then. Ultimately, the cost depends on the components that go into making the upper. A Noveske barrel alone sells for about $350-$400.

The price that you give for brass at $1 each is not correct either. I was selling brass for about .30 each and I think that Hoser was selling it for less than that.

I am kind of liking the 300WTF name more and more.

How ever it's sliced or diced
 

I started out 10 years ago with a 300 whisper barrel from SSK and have acquired a number of barrels marked 300-221, 300 whisper , and my latest a 300 Blackout from MGM. All are great shooters using my Hornady 300 Whisper dies to load rounds. I for one am very happy AAC has promoted and got the cartridge standardized. New manufacturers daily it seems making a gun or cartridge. It looks like this new cartridge will be around awhile. Looking forward to the day where good bolt guns from several manufactures are designed around the cartridge. As soon as I read Remington, Ruger, Savage, or CZ has one that is 100% reliable bolt fed magazines, I will get one and give my single shots a rest. It I can't wait that long, I reckon a black gun AR platform will follow me home.

Reformed brass though. Brass with correct head stamps was closer to $1 each. Reformed brass is 10-14 cents each now, depending on who is selling it and the quality.

Actually in the 6.8 it is about 1500 psi difference between 6.8 SAAMI and SPC-II, which is not much at all.

If we kept an older name, then the factory test barrels would have to be based on the tightest chamber ever made with the old names, and then factory velocity would have been lower.

Before BLK, you generally had a requirement for an adjustable gas system to shoot subsonic and full power ammo in the same rifle. You also had reliability problems due to bullet/magazine compatibility. That is all fixed now - taking the concept to the next level.

It’s no different than Mopar guys referring to their car as a B-Body. The Charger, Roadrunner, GTX, Coronet, and Belvedere all had the same body with different trim. Most components are interchangeable. If I’m looking for a big block engine for my Charger, I would ask if anyone had a B or an RB for my B-Body. If I need a bumper for the same car, it would be for a Charger. If I say I own an F-body, Chevy guys know I have a Camaro, Trans Am or Firebird. Just because someone refers to it as 300 WTF does not mean they’re referring to only the Blackout. Most of the guys on this board don’t own a 300 Whisper, Blackout, 30-221, 300 fireball, they own several. A 125gr BT works well in all the chambering. It would be ridiculous to say that the 125 BT works well in the 300 Blackout, 300 Whisper, 30 fireball, and 30-221. Most of the things you say about the Blackout are valid. I made new brass for $0.18 a piece. I hate making brass and I don’t use mixed head stamps. The availability of the Blackout means I don’t have to if I don’t want to. Bullet technology will be better for the case. Most everything else we had before. The difference was that the mass uninformed gun buying public had no clue. When you take them into account more of your statements are valid. The Blackout is essentially the Cliff notes version of the Whisper. Some gun people are not tinkerers. The Blackout’s for them. I have one and I like it. If you love one you have to love them all. Your rhetoric seems to imply that all the 300 variants cease to exist when the Blackout was introduced. None of the Whisper owners have a problem with the Blackout. How you present the Blackout is what has bothered a few. Having a sense of humor about it may help you. You could always take Spook out for lunch sometime. Group helicopter pig hut anyone. Now it would be funny if you took the picture of you next to the helicopter an added the caption “Preparing for the airstrike on Quorterbore”. Lighten up a bit.

Wrong. Guys just got a small port and loaded short. Just like the Blackout. Model-1 sales guns all needed 1680 because of this. It was also common to throat them out because it was chambered in the 30-221.

The reason for the 300 WTF term, at least for a few people, is to avoid acknowledging 300 BLK.

300 WTF is code for "I was using this before 300 BLK."

I know this is not everyone - others just have several chambers and need an all-inclusive term when talking about them all.

True some guys set up their guns like that, and used A1680, but others did large port and could not shoot full power ammo. With Remington making subsonic ammo, Noveske changed their port to be compatible with the new ammo, and dozens of makers standardized on this configuration.

As for loading short - that is no longer needed. I got Sierra, Barnes, and Remington to make new bullets designed for 300 BLK and meant to be loaded to full mag length.

And that's all good....

I hope everyone has a good Christmas. Robert, Santa got me a Ti-Rant. No hard feelings my brother.

Also there will be a jacketed lead plastic tipped bullet available to reloaders in 2012, fully optimal for mag length. Yes, have a Merry Christmas.

Thats it for me...
 

http://img4.uploadhouse.com/fileuplo...e1cc760a22.jpg

No More 300 blk ... Monday I'm calling Kiff for a reamer thats .0005 longer in the throat and .0005 bigger in the shoulder and I'm calling it the "300 WTF."(R). :grin:

The new generation of bullets offer some benefits - the UMC is able to be loaded as long as 5.56mm ammo, as we did a large radius ogive designed to contact the magazine just right. Also, the reason it can be so long (to fill the mag to keep the rounds from sliding around, and to have a higher BC) and still be just 115 grains is the air pocket in the noise, like the Russian 7N6 bullet:

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/view...?f=151&t=78183

http://shop.bullseyeindoorrange.com/...0(800x601).jpg

http://www.cruffler.com/Features/OCT...ossSection.jpg

The bullet is made like an OTM - sealed at the bottom, but then the nose is struck closed. The Sierra 125 Match is also like this. As well as two others due very soon, and then four more due later in 2012.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_121/5...ut.html&page=4

This is how I typically see people use the term WTF. It is hard for me to sort out the people who use it endearingly vs to denigrate it.

...the truly amazing thing is this thread hasnt shown you that how you typically see anything doesnt matter much.