Need a little help with a Whisper Upper Problem

[DonT]

Thought I would check to see if someone could give me some direction. I am having a real issue with a Model 1 Sales upper I just bought. It was used and is in 300 Fireball.

My issue is in functioning. It will feed fine using 168 gr FMJ, RP 223 brass formed and trimmed to 1.355. For the most part it feeds fine but when you drop the bolt on a single round you cannot get the gun open to eject the loaded round. It starts to open then just hangs, like the bolt is not turning far enough in the carrier to unlock. I can rap the butt on the bench while pulling on the charging handle and it will not move any further. The only way to get it out is to fire it.

Now the interesting part. It has a MGImilitary adjustable gas tube. If I turn it closed then back it out 1 1/2 turns as recommended as a starting point the rifle fires but does not eject. Another 1/4 turn and the round ejects but does not lock open. Another 1/4 turn and gun jams up when fired. The fired round remains in the chamber, the bolt either does not move or pulls a portion of the rim off and the round needs to be tapped out with a cleaning rod and it takes a bit to get it loose.

My loads are 168gr FMJ pushed with 12.8 gr of H110 and remington benchrest primers. Certainly not a hot load by any stretch. I have checked the loads on a digital and Ohaus beam scale and they are right on.

I am perplexed to say the least. I have never had this type of problem with am AR style rifle before, although the others have all be .223 or .308.

The brass does not have any signs of excessive headspacing. I have, on a number of occassions, had to remove the lower and manually cock the hammer, put the gun back together and fire it a second time to get it to clear. I have also had to remove the butt, recoil tube & spring because the gun did not go into full battery and the forward assist would not move the bolt closed enough to break it open. I have a small brass hammer and have had to use this to wrap the bolt carrier forward to get it to lock in place (not something I cherish doing with a live round stuck in the chamber) then manually cock the hammer reasseble everything and fire the rifle.

I am very very furstrated and about ready to use the upper as a tomato stake in the garden. Actually I was planning on polishing the chamber and pulling the extractor appart, polish lightly and see if there is anything hanging it up around the return spring.

Anyone got any other ideas. The gas adjustment has me really baffled. My first thought was timing but so many folks use H110 I would think this would not be the issue. The person I bought the upper from said he had no problems and I have the stock gas tube, I am considering putting that back in it and starting from scratch. I was told the upper was assembled by Model 1 Sales with the exception of changing out the gas tube...

HELP>>>>>>>>>

thanks,,
DonT:frown:

[GunGeek]

DonT,
Case neck wall thickness or case length vs headspace could be your problem.

If the case neck is too thick it will cause the case to bind between the bullet and chamber wall. Need to check and see what the chamber neck diameter is.
If the case is too long, same basic thing happens but the end of the case neck gets stuck between the bullet and chamber throat. Either one ould be casuing teh cases to stick.

Try chambering an unloaded case that has been resized and see if that functions. Then we can work on the loaded cases.

The gas tube setting should just be put on the back burner till you get the system to function manually without binding.

This should get you started.
You can contact me direct
john at krtraining dot com
or keep it on the boards for others to chime in and in case someone else has that same problem.
Shoot Early, Shoot Often, It's the Chicago way.
John

[ranger dave]

its your brass the .223 cut down stuff is to thick try some 221 fireball brass or get some brass from davis on this net the brass is real funny the first time you load it it real striches and needs to be trimed 1.355 is the right size for modle 1 feel free to email me for more help shoot_ranger@yahoo

[DonT]

Thanks for the help fellas I am back in business!!!!!

GunGeek I did as you suggested and it was the brass. First round stuck solid and had to be pushed out with a rod. Ran it thru my sizing die and tried it again and it was just fine. Loaded up 20 rounds and took her to the range & is purred like kitten. 100 yd groups in the 1MOA range... To say I am a happy camper now is an understatement..:grin:

Ranger Dave, thanks for the help I actually got 500 rnds from Davis. It was the primed stuff he sells and it was a bit too long for my Savage Bolt gun and needed to be trimmed about 20 thou. so I trimmed it all. Since it was primed I never gave any thought to it not being fully resized but it appears that was the problem. Either that or the redding dies are slighty tighter tolerances. Please note this is nothing against Mr. Davis' brass. What I got looked great and was shipped promptly. This is a wildcat cartridge and I know that there are some variances in chambers and my AR must be a little on the tight side..

Again thanks folks I do appreciate the help as it got me calmed down and pointed in the right direction.. And if you are listening Quaterbore, a big thank you to you also as I have learned much about the 300 whisper on this site and it wouldn't have been here if not for you..
DonT

[rednek58]

I had the same chamber sticking problem with the last batch of Mr. Davis' brass in a M1 barrel. Ran it thru a Redding die and problem solved. Not sure what dies Mr. Davis uses or maybe with the vast amount he processes the die may be slightly worn since a previous lot did not cause this problem. Everything said, Mr. Davis' brass is top notch and Iam preparing to place another order. I recommend his product very highly and his customer service is second to none. Note, I am not connected to Mr. Davis in any way other than being a satisfied customer.