300 Whisper AK - Just found a gas block that might be a good start...

[Quarterbore]

I have no idea how many of these are available but I grabbed two of these for my own projects:

http://ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=123&t=293752&page=1�

Gas block with shut-off valve for grenade-launching Polish PMK (Kbkg60) as seen on page 66 of the Tokoi AK book. Brand new, never assembled. Very rare! $15 each plus shipping. Great for a suppressed AK.

http://www.quarterbore.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72&stc=1

http://www.quarterbore.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=71&stc=1

Looks like this:

http://www.quarterbore.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=70&stc=1

I am pretty sure that these gas blocks will not give us adjustable gas flow as they are made BUT if we were to makie a replacement for that insert that was tapered then an adjustable gas system for the AK is quite possible.... I will not have the money or time to try a 300 Whisper AK anytime soon but this may be a very difficult to find gas block in the future...

Now I need to look into a 223 parts kit (if there is such a beast?) or consider cutting up my SAR-3 or buy another... :bangin:

Good Luck!

[gt3499a]

What are the case deminsions for a standard 7.62x39 case?

While you are doing something unique like that you might as well go all out and make it a 375 or 416 or even the 338 whisper.

how cool would that be to have an AK in 375 whisper with an adjustable gas system? :D


Dan

[Quarterbore]

Well you do bring up a good point... the 7.62x39 case head is about if not the same size as the 308 case and this is what the 338 Whisper #2 was based off of. Still, the COL on this was designed to run out of a 308 length magazine.

Perhaps the smart thing is to see if I can get a working adjustable gas system in a normal 7.62x39 and then work on a good practical use for it... 338x39 does sound... umm... interesting?

[Greywuuf]

There is allready a 9x39, suposedly a soviet supressed weapon. I plan to do a .357 barrel for my AMD (as opposed to .355 for a 9mm).
should be fun.

[Greywuuf]

Also, I think the "original" (and to me number 1) .338 whisper was the 7mmBR short (.308 base) and the second or number 2 was actually a .338 fireball.

Also from memory the 308/30-06 ( and many many many other) boltface is .473" the soviet is I think .440 ( as is the PPC ) which was the original problem in getting a bolt action PPC. I KNOW the 308 dimension is correct, the soviet is from memory.

The .223/.221/fireball/whisper is within a few thou of the .357 mag ( and also very close to the 9mm para) at uhm doesn't come easily to mind, but it is on the order of .3xx sumpthing... at any rate quite a bit smaller than the 7.62x39, however the 5.54x39 is pretty close

Just a little interesting fact that some of you might not know the 45 ACP is based on the .308 (actually the -06) as well and has a .473 bolt face as well.

Most decent loading manuals have this info and if you are truly interested.. pick up a copy of "Cartridges of the World" (older copies are good too as stuff is added and dropped on ocasion.. such as I don't think all of the oddball whispers ie:7.62 mini and micro are in the current version)

hopefully I will be able to shed more light on many of these subjects soon as I have an AMD that is going to be a .357 bore soon.

[Greywuuf]

I should have said the BASE dimension of the .223 and the .357 mag are similar... the .357 being a rimmed case has a larger "bolt face"
I know this because I have run a number of .357 mag brass into a cut down fireball die for a 22 jet variations that I have a contender carbine in ... and I am using .223 brass in a custom .357 auto chamber for a little high pressure insurance.

[Quarterbore]

Some very interesting facts! I have been looking at one of my Tantial kits and the 5.45x39 cartridges and I am starting to think that a wildcat in a 300/5.45 might be interesting as well


5.45 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 7.62x39

http://world.guns.ru/ammo/5_45x39_size.jpg - - - - - - - - - - - - -- - - - - - - - http://world.guns.ru/ammo/7_62x39_size.jpg

I just don't know if I am foolish enough or ready for a project like that anytime soon... I also have not looked at the availability of brass 5.45x39 casings of how similar these would be to 223 brass... Just idle thoughts while looking at a tantial kit I guess :)

[Greywuuf]

I heard a rumor that brass 5.45x39 (actually about 39.5) are sometimes available. Caution! they are NOT similar to the 5.56 round at all (.223 rem either) they look like a smaller version of the 7.62x39 round, and don't make the mistake of thinking they are based off the 7.62x39... they are not, they are overall smaller, though still fatter than the 5.56. I have a couple actual combat casings ( picked up around an airport in "A"stan) if you are interested shoot me a PM and I might be able to send you one. Check over on the 6.5 grendel board, there is some interest there, and is where I caught wind of the brass cases.

[ranger dave]

well lets see there is the same thing back that up i have had a whisper for over 16 years and ak s for longer then that you can load a 7.62x39 with the same data as a 300 whisper i have a can on my ak the sub sonic load is a 180g .311 soft point with 7.5 g of 2400 do some reading the load data is about the same

[m21black]

No comparision when you compare a 180 grain .311 bullet to a .308 240 Sierra HPBT. Kinda like comparing a VW Bug to a 18 Wheel Semi.

[Wrangler]

I don't want to get hit with either one. I am too fragile to be hit with a VW or a semi. Ya pays your money and ya' takes your choice. It is funny how many guns and calibers there are. I am in favor of a pack howitzer myself. Not sure how I would pack it but what a round that would be!!!!'Wonder if I could get a subsonic one?

[m21black]

There sure is alot of new cartriges today, funny thing is that most of the new stuff was tinkered with 100 years ago just get Po Ackleys book. This biggest thing to change is the selection of powders. After it is all said and done marksmenship is the one thing that can't be replaced.

[Quarterbore]

I have not done anything with this project but if I could get some 5.45x39 brass and resize it to .308 I am thinking that a 240-gr bullet in that small case should perform similar to a 300/221...

I just have not had the time lately to do much beond work and family :eek:

[m21black]

My experiance is limited to the 300 Whisper, 9.2 grains of H-110 gives me 1050 FPS with a 240 grain Sierra. Small amounts of powder with this small cartridge can make large pressure and velocity differences. You also need to make sure your projectile has enough balls to make out of the barrel.

[ranger dave]

well there is 60g differents not that anything could tell when hit by it the idea is to come up with a sub sonic round that will work in the ak this got me thinking i found some 220g in .311 and loaded them with whisper data they fire ok but at 7 moa they suck i think its the twist of my ak oh well with the 180g im getting 2 moa in my ak and 3/4 moa out of a cumstom 700 i have in 7.62x39 dont get me wrong i love my whispers have for 15 years but the 7.62x39 will do the samething with good loads and im sure that 180g bullet at 1035 fps will kill anything i may run into:uzi2:

[Bigfoot]

Hornady makes a 178 gr. A-MAX. It's a .308 bullet so it might be iffy in a .311 bore (paper patch?) but it's a target bullet with similar construction to the V-MAX varmint bullet so I'm curious to see if it expands at 1000 fps.

Dave what is the twist rate on an AK, my web search came up empty. My SKS seems to be 9.5:1.