My Method For Making 300/221 Brass

[Scalce]

Well my suppressor and SBR paperwork is pending so to keep myself busy I am playing around with making some 300/221 brass.

I bought a set of Redding FL, neck, and seater dies.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=244465

http://media.midwayusa.com/ProductImages/Medium/244465.jpg

I bought a Bench Top Cut-Off Saw to cut down my 223 brass after running through the neck sizing die without the stem.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=42307

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/photos/42300-42399/42307.gif

Then I FL resize with the 308 expander in it.

I then trim with a custom Possum Hollow trimmer I just received.

http://www.possumhollowproducts.com/kwick-case-trimmers.html

http://www.possumhollowproducts.com/products/kwick-case-trimmer.jpg

So far the process isn't too bad but I need to wait until I get a barrel to do large runs.

I am practicing on some old 223 brass that has loose primer pockets.

Any issues you guys can see with my steps?

Thanks

[sten668]

I have used the same equipment for a few years now, my trimmer is an old Herters. It is not fast like the power trimmers of today but it works just fine. I take the time to debur the primer hole and sort brass by maker and date if I am going for pure accuracy in my bolt gun. I built a little jig to place the brass in so I don't have to measure each one before cutting it off.
What else is there to do on cold winter nights besides cut brass, cast bullets and cuss the government???

[Scalce]

I figured out a cheap jig to use for trimming the brass with the mini cut-off saw tonight.

I put an old shot out 308 case in the jaws and the top of the resized 223 case fits just right in the case mouth to line it up to cut the brass right at the shoulder.

The cut piece just falls out and you grab another piece of brass.

I'll have to take a pic.

[ATLRoach]

I figured out a cheap jig to use for trimming the brass with the mini cut-off saw tonight.

I put an old shot out 308 case in the jaws and the top of the resized 223 case fits just right in the case mouth to line it up to cut the brass right at the shoulder.

The cut piece just falls out and you grab another piece of brass.

I'll have to take a pic.

I would love to see the pic of this.

Also whom at Possum Hollow did you speak with and how long to have it made? I'm very interested.

[PFDD]

Pretty slick; I was wondering what kind of jig to use and thought I might use my Wilson trimmer case holder. I was going to try it tonight to see if it worked.

Wilson sells case holders for both fired and unfired brass so I could size before or after depending on what version I'm using. I think my caseholder is for unfired brass which means I'd have to size my once fired Lack City brass first. Not a problem but I like your method and will give it a try. Ditto on wanting to see a picture when you get one.

Thanks,

Brad

[Scalce]

I would love to see the pic of this.

Also whom at Possum Hollow did you speak with and how long to have it made? I'm very interested.

I emailed Eric Sinclair who owns the business.

http://www.possumhollowproducts.com/contact-us.html

I think he made it in a few weeks if I remember correctly.

It's their 223 trimmer with the shoulder indexing hole bored out to the 308 trimmer dimensions.

You don't have a ton of case to hold onto but it works.

I bought one of those rubber pads from KMart that you use to open stuck jar lids and cut it into a small cross so I can grip the case and protect my finger from getting a nice bruise from the case head pressing against it.

http://s.sears.com/is/image/Sears/011W911162110001?hei=180&wid=180&op_sharpen=1&qlt=75

http://www.kmart.com/shc/s/p_10151_10104_011W911162110001P?keyword=rubber

[ATLRoach]

I emailed Eric Sinclair who owns the business.

http://www.possumhollowproducts.com/contact-us.html

I think he made it in a few weeks if I remember correctly.

It's their 223 trimmer with the shoulder indexing hole bored out to the 308 trimmer dimensions.

You don't have a ton of case to hold onto but it works.

I bought one of those rubber pads from KMart that you use to open stuck jar lids and cut it into a small cross so I can grip the case and protect my finger from getting a nice bruise from the case head pressing against it.

http://s.sears.com/is/image/Sears/011W911162110001?hei=180&wid=180&op_sharpen=1&qlt=75

http://www.kmart.com/shc/s/p_10151_10104_011W911162110001P?keyword=rubber

Thanks I just emailed them. I have been using a band saw to cut my virgin brass, using 204 Ruger Rem brass BPS had on sale, and a wilson/sinclair trimmer to finalize the trim then neck trimming with a K&M w/ a power adapter.It just takes to long to finalize the trim which the P.H. would speed up.

[Scalce]

Here are the pics.

http://webpages.charter.net/jscalcione/DSC01330.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/jscalcione/DSC01329.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/jscalcione/DSC01332.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/jscalcione/DSC01333.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/jscalcione/DSC01337.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/jscalcione/DSC01338.jpg

[MadDog]

I am going to have to get one of those cut off saws. That is much easier than what I have been doing.

[PFDD]

I tried using the Wilson case holders but they wouldn't fit in the jaws of the HF mini cut off saw's vice so I tried your .308 case method. Had to open up a fired case just a touch more to get the resized .223 case neck in but it works pretty slick. Your brass jig is a definite enhancement over anything I was dreaming up. Thank you for sharing the tip!


One thing I've noticed on the HF saw is that it's a bit underpowered and leaves a fairly ragged cut (OK it's cheap). I wonder if I'm just trying to cut too fast and since I don't have it anchored down perhaps I'm inducing more flex than it would otherwise have, so I'll try it again with better anchoring. I do wish the blade was a bit finer toothed, but it's the best tool I have for this purpose and it's a heck of a lot better than the hacksaw or tubing cutter method I tried previously.

I'm doing the final trimming on the Giraud and it's doing its typically great job once I got the blade adjustment set.

Thank you again.

[Scalce]

Yeah I agree on the lack of power and that a finer tooth blade would cut much cleaner.

If you go too fast the blade will slow which is probably what is happening to you.

You can always put an old file next to the mini saw and drag the brass across it to get the nasty burs off but I haven't had too much of an issue trimming while it has a rough edge.

Hopefully my barrel comes in soon so I can start producing properly sized cases.

Happy trimming

[PFDD]

Well, I just came in from the garage where it became obvious why my blade on the Harbor Freight saw was dragging and stopping when I smelled hot plastic after making 2 and a half cuts on cases.

I pulled the guard off the left side and had quite an accumulation of rubber debris from the belt where it was slipping because the saw driving cog was't adequately secured and was slipping on the shaft. That resulted in extra heat buildup and the cog rested against the belt cover melting an indentation in it. Oh joy! I tried securing the set screw on the saw driving cog but it acted like it was stripped and I didn't have any metric replacements on hand

I must have received one made before some Chinese national holiday. When I originally pulled it out off the box I noticed the cord cover was outside the housing too but I didn't worry about that as I wasn't planning on stressing the cord. Reminds me of a Volve Turbo I once owned that must have been made the afternoon before Swedish summer holiday. What a piece of crap that was.

Now to see what Harbor Freight is willing to do about it. Guess I got what I paid for and less....

Update: I called HF customer service and they're sending a prepaid return Fedex label for return credit since I'm within 30 days of purchase. I have a local HF store I wasn't aware of and I'll pick up a replacement there as they won't take a mail order return. Suboptimal, but not bad in all.

The saw may not be as underpowered as I thought given the slipping drive belt I was experiencing. It will never be a powerhouse but seems to be adequate for the task and saves a lot of brass shavings.

[sten668]

Great pictures, love your jig, I think it will work better than mine.
I bought some little abrasive fiber wheels to use on the saw they seem to work just fine.
Now to get that power trimmer...

[Scalce]

Great pictures, love your jig, I think it will work better than mine.
I bought some little abrasive fiber wheels to use on the saw they seem to work just fine.
Now to get that power trimmer...

Glad I could help.

What size blades does your cutter take?

Also what trimmers are you looking at?

[sten668]

I have the same cut off saw. So I got blades that fit it, can't say of the top of my head, they may be just a little larger. The trimmer that you have is what I have been looking at but my drill press is out in the shed with no heat and the forester hand trimmer has been working....slow.
The problem I am having now is that the mill brass I have is not sizing down enough to fit in my new M1S barrel unless I use another 223 die to get it smaller. My have to go with a small base die for 100% reliability in my auto and keep the brass separate from my bolt gun stuff.

[Scalce]

I have the same cut off saw. So I got blades that fit it, can't say of the top of my head, they may be just a little larger. The trimmer that you have is what I have been looking at but my drill press is out in the shed with no heat and the forester hand trimmer has been working....slow.
The problem I am having now is that the mill brass I have is not sizing down enough to fit in my new M1S barrel unless I use another 223 die to get it smaller. My have to go with a small base die for 100% reliability in my auto and keep the brass separate from my bolt gun stuff.

So even with the press camming over, the 300 die is not resizing enough for you?

Have you tried resizing the cases in your 223 dies before forming?

[sten668]

Yes and Yes, I have a number of dies 223AI, 7TCU, 222, 223, 17 Rem and have tried them all. Last night I dug through a box I got at an auction and found a forming die from 223 to 17 Rem, bingo it worked, it took the base down another .002 to .0025 smaller than all the other dies. They will run thru my AR just fine now at .373. The small base die was just a click away and some how I resisted. The brass I am resizing is bulk mil stuff I have had a number of years it measures about .375 to .376 and factory nonfired stuff is measuring .372 to .373.
Get that Can yet? What one is it? I have had most everything with a large enought barrel threaded that is 30 cal or less. Just got back my 10-22 and what a hoot...

[Scalce]

Get that Can yet? What one is it? I have had most everything with a large enought barrel threaded that is 30 cal or less. Just got back my 10-22 and what a hoot...

No but I think I am close.

The ATF sent my class III dealer a letter saying they wanted to see my signed Declaration of Trust which is a small part of my overall Trust document.

Both my lawyer and my dealer said they do not need it and now the ATF is saying they need it.

Hopefully I get it in a few weeks.

It's an AAC 762SD and I have mounts for my Rem 700 5R, AR-10, 300 Whisper build, and various ARs in 223/556.

[jonblack]

Well my suppressor and SBR paperwork is pending so to keep myself busy I am playing around with making some 300/221 brass.

I bought a set of Redding FL, neck, and seater dies.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=244465

http://media.midwayusa.com/ProductImages/Medium/244465.jpg


Are all three dies needed to make .300 Fireball brass from .223? Are the dies used for reloading after the brass has been formed?

I apologize for the question, but I am just trying to wrap my head around the process of making brass from .223 brass.

Thank you
jonblack

EDIT - fixed typo in quote code

[Scalce]

Are all three dies needed to make .300 Fireball brass from .223? Are the dies used for reloading after the brass has been formed?

I apologize for the question, but I am just trying to wrap my head around the process of making brass from .223 brass.

Thank you
jonblack

EDIT - fixed typo in quote code

Well two of the three dies are used to form the brass and the third is a seater die.

So yes, I use all three dies.

You either need a trim die or a neck sizing die to do the initial form and cut/trim depending on your method.

I do have a 650 like you but I am not going to invest in the 1200 trimmer, C&H trim die, and deal with all the stuff that goes along with it.

I can make a few hundred cases pretty easy using the method I outlined and I don't plan to loose my brass very often.

[jonblack]

Scalce

Thanks for the reply. I have about 20k of .223 brass so I figured I would turn a couple 2-3 thousand into Whisper. I need to process the .223 brass anyway, so I was already planning on getting a RT-1200 for that. Adding the C-H trim die is affordable in comparison, so I figured what the heck.

Thanks again
jonblack

[Scalce]

Scalce

Thanks for the reply. I have about 20k of .223 brass so I figured I would turn a couple 2-3 thousand into Whisper. I need to process the .223 brass anyway, so I was already planning on getting a RT-1200 for that. Adding the C-H trim die is affordable in comparison, so I figured what the heck.

Thanks again
jonblack

Ahhhhh

A brass whore after my own heart.

Are you going to just use one specific headstamp?

If you do go with the 1200 then you just need the FL sizer and seater dies along with the C&H trim die.

[coldbeerchief]

I made 200 pieces using virgin LC brass today and it was a piece of cake!

I like the fact that the necks came out much more concentric than the 221 Fireball brass I used before.:nanabang:

[N310toN170]

Thanks for the suggestions! I have a Harbor Freight fairly close to my home and after reading thru the article had to give this method a try.

Unfortunately, the first saw only turned on about a half dozen times, then the switch went out. The second one is still working. The very first thing that should be done after unpacking it is to remove the blade cover and reinstall the screw that holds the blade in place with Loc-tite or similar compound! The blade on my assembly almost came completely undone while cutting brass.

I used the suggested method with an old .308 case but was having a hard time getting even cuts so I tried this...

Take a 1 1/2" x 1/2" piece of wood and cut two lengths between 4" and 6":

Place them together and drill a 1/4" pilot hole:

Using the pilot hole drill out to 3/8":

Now that your working with a 3/8" hole, use a 3/8" spade bit and drill to the depth of the original .223 shoulder:

Set the new wood channel in-line with the .308 case, once aligned tighten the clamp:

With this setup I was able to get a good, clean, straight cut on the brass and minimize the work needed on the much more exact trimmer blades:

[jonblack]

Scale

As for the brass I use to make .300 Whisper, yes, I will sort it by head stamp. I will most likely sort my LC stuff by year as well, just to provide another level of uniformity.

As for the .223 I process, I won't sort by head stamp.

jonblack

[Scalce]

Thanks for the suggestions! I have a Harbor Freight fairly close to my home and after reading thru the article had to give this method a try.

Unfortunately, the first saw only turned on about a half dozen times, then the switch went out. The second one is still working. The very first thing that should be done after unpacking it is to remove the blade cover and reinstall the screw that holds the blade in place with Loc-tite or similar compound! The blade on my assembly almost came completely undone while cutting brass.

I used the suggested method with an old .308 case but was having a hard time getting even cuts so I tried this...

Take a 1 1/2" x 1/2" piece of wood and cut two lengths between 4" and 6":

Place them together and drill a 1/4" pilot hole:

Using the pilot hole drill out to 3/8":

Now that your working with a 3/8" hole, use a 3/8" spade bit and drill to the depth of the original .223 shoulder:

Set the new wood channel in-line with the .308 case, once aligned tighten the clamp:

With this setup I was able to get a good, clean, straight cut on the brass and minimize the work needed on the much more exact trimmer blades:

Nice work with the wood holder.

Freehanding sucks because you can cut it at an angle, cut it and leave a nice tab of sharp metal to shave off, etc..

It completes our inexpensive method of trimming 300 Whisper brass. :grin:

BTW My chop blade also loosened so I had to tighten it.

[pelallito]

Hello,
Has anybody considered the 6" chop saw that HF sells for trimming the brass? It costs another $5 but could be usefull for other projects.
http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-cut-off-saw-41453.html
I am a newbie here, so any help or advice is happily accepted.
Thanks,
Regards,
Fred

[pelallito]

Scalce and N310toN170,
Thanks for posting this system of trimming the .223 brass for 300 whisper conversion. I am using it and it works great. Before I started cutting any brass I used locktite on everything that I read about in your threads, and the little saw is working great.
Regards,
Fred

[sha-ul]

I know it is a little different than what is posted here, but I have picked up a Redding file trim die for the 300w, what is the proper method for using these?

[pelallito]

Maybe this will help-http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=757107
In the comments someone stated that they use a fine hacksaw blade to cut off the top of the case. Someone else said he needed an extended shell holder to make it work.
Fred