Is there a reason a 223 AK wouldn't be whisper-able?

[este]

If not, then why has no one (that I could find) done it?

[amafrank]

I suppose that other than the front sight base, gasblock and rear sight base that have to very tight on the barrel and pinned in place you only have the trunnion pin and more snug fits to create and all of them must line up perfectly. Once all that is done you need a very large gas port since a good deal of the operating gas is intended to leak past the piston and with subsonics you are short on gas. After all this is done you end up with an AK and one of the main points of the cartridge is its accuracy which will not be evident in the AK. So to summarize, The AK requires a lot more work to convert, its no where near as accurate as an AR, Bolt action of any type, or other suitable conversion candidate, and it probably won't work with both subs and supers. I don't think I missed anything but its possible....

In any case it can be done but for most guys its not worth doing.

Hope that helps

Frank

[este]

All good points frank.

I'm curious how quiet an AK could get. Or if the action or vents is too loud.

As far as what I had in mind, a custom heavy barrel from a blank I have, no front sight, adjustable gas block, the gas port could then be large without ruining too many other things, it'll only be shot suppressed so I guess that would help with subsonics. The barrel pin and trunnion would need work of course.

About the gas leaking past note, do you know if that is because of the canted gas port? I wonder if the AK101's vertical port would be any different?


I wonder how much of the AKs accuracy problem is tollerance of moving parts, barrel, or it's piston design? If I'm going through all this I suppose it would be worth a look.


I k ow it's a goofball idea, and probably a bad one to boot. However, I appreciate the feedback.

[amafrank]

I believe a big part of the accuracy issues are because of all the crap attached to the barrel as well as the thin barrel diameter. The loose fitting bolt is probably another source of variation in the consistancy of case location and therefore accuracy as well.
The gasport being angled has nothing to do with leakage and was done to make it easier to make. The straight port on the later AK series requires drilling the port in 2 stages, one hole from the bottom and one from the rear of the gasblock. The right angle in the port is probably more prone to buildup. The leakage in the system is due to the way the system works. Gas pressure pushes the piston back about 1/4 to 3/8 of an inch with a reasonable seal. Once it clears the gasblock and enters the gastube the clearances are much greater and the gas is vented. There is a lot more clearance even in the gasblock itself because the system is designed for reliablity and operation in extreme conditions. The extra clearance means less jamming up with carbon buildup or debris. With all this clearance built in the gasport is larger than it would need to be in a tighter setup to allow for that. If you built a tighter fitting gasblock and gastube that retained the pressure better and for a longer period of time you may be able to get it working. Its not simple to do however and requires a lot of extra work. In my opinion thats the main reason no one has done it.
Lastly the noise level. Since the AK has a larger than normal gasport and it vents the gas fairly quickly it is quite noisy even with a suppressor. In fact the suppressor just makes matters worse. In testing with a .223 AK belonging to a friend and with a 7.62 AK that I have we saw that the noise level suppressed was not much different unless the gasport was blocked. My AK is a grenade launching type with a gas cutoff and my friends .223 AK had a cutoff added. With the gas blocked the guns were much quieter and the supersonic bullets made most of the noise.

I hope that explains some of the reasoning and if you decided to build one of them you should have some idea of what needs to be done.

Frank

[este]

Again, I appreciate the feedback! Lots of good info there. I'll have to let that all sink in.

I had considered an adjustable AK gas block like this:
http://www.copesdistributing.net/images/AKGasAdjGasBlock.JPG

But this is the ONLY one I could find, it looks large, heavy, and I'm not sure how it works. I think maybe I will look at a piston AR block and see about how that would work. Since I plan on a diameter heavier than .6 which seems to be the largest diameter any ak "sniper" was ever made in.

I understand how the suppressor would make the exhaust sound it worse, it will decrease the exit speed of the gas which will increase the pressure. However, I'm curious as to how much noise it would make with a subsonic round? Maybe similar because regardless of bullet speed, there has to be enough gas to cycle the action, once it's done it'll vent all the same. Although I suspect if the block were adjustable one could limit the amount of excess gas to a minimum.